Meagan Moore on Problem-solving with STEAM

Meagan Moore cutting vinyl for PPE What happens when you include art in science, technology, engineering and math? You create STEAM or in this case, Meagan the Maker. Meagan Moore, a senior in biological engineering at LSU, is a creative force using her wealth of unique artistic and problem-solving talents to find solutions for everything from prototyping PPE for healthcare professionals during the pandemic to fabricating life sizes 3D phantoms used in breast cancer research. She joins LSU Experimental host Becky Carmichael via Zoom to discuss her research projects and what she aspires to tackle next. (Transcript below.)

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LSU Experimental is a podcast series that shares the research and the “behind the scenes” stories of LSU faculty, student, and alumni investigators across the disciplines. Listen and learn about the exciting topics of study and the individuals posing the questions. Each episode is recorded and produced in CxC Studio 151 on the campus of Louisiana State University, and is supported by LSU Communication across the Curriculum and LSU College of Science. LSU Experimental is hosted by Dr. Becky Carmichael and edited by Kyle Sirovy.

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Transcript

Becky Carmichael

[0:02] This is LSU Experimental, where we explore exciting research occurring at Louisiana State University and learn about the individuals posing the questions. I'm Becky Carmichael. For this episode, we're joined by Meagan Moore, aka Meagan the Maker, a senior in biological engineering in the College of Engineering here at LSU. Meagan is a creative force, who uses her artistic and problem solving talents to find solutions for everything from prototyping PPE for healthcare professionals during the pandemic, to fabricating life size 3Dphantoms used in breast cancer research. She joins me via Zoom for this episode, where we dive into her stem and steam journey and what she aspires to tackle next.

Becky Carmichael

[0:56] Meagan, thank you for joining me today. For my first in-the-closet type of recording situation I have, we're doing some quarantine closet sessions. And I'm excited to talk to you about your involvement with LSU and what you've been doing to help with our health care workers and first responders and creating materials. So thank you for joining me.

Meagan Moore

[1:28] Happily. It's good to be here.

Becky Carmichael

[1:30] Yeah. So I like to start these sessions with getting to know the guests. So would you tell our listeners a little bit about who you are and your background?

Meagan Moore

[1:40] Yes, so my name is Meagan Moore. I'm a student in biological engineering at LSU. Currently, and I do research out of Wayne Newhauser's medical Physics Lab at LSU. But I have a kind of extensive background in research in a bunch of different areas ranging from neuroscience and microbiology to some climate research with NASA and some other fun little pockets that just kind of occurred over the years.

Becky Carmichael

[2:07] Okay, so I definitely want to know a little bit more about this this wealth of experience you have with research. But let's we'll start with kind of your work with Dr. Newhauser. How did you get involved with his work? And what are you specifically doing with with his group.

Meagan Moore

[2:24] So to start off with, I got involved with Wayne's work by being actually his artist for his TEDx talk. And then afterwards, I went and spoke with him. I was in another Research Lab at the time and ended up that summer like literally a month later, 3D printing the first full scale human one to one for radiation therapy. And then I've been working in his lab for about three years now. And around the time that the quarantine started, I got a call from him. I'd already been working on a couple of things, kind of prototyping stuff on my own. I get a call He's like, hey, do you want to come to my house, we're going to be in the garage, we'll social distance, we want to prototype things, because we got a call from the hospital and they're in dire need. And they're looking at these numbers and they don't know how they're going to handle things. And so I showed up with a couple of other people from the lab and my roommate, and we started just kind of playing with materials. And we started from scratch. I'm talking cardboard and trash bags, and playing with basic materials that anybody could have access to so we could create a template that anybody could replicate just by like printing out the materials or looking at a general gist of what you'd be trying to make. And so we went from making trash bag hospital gowns based off of an actual hospital gown to eventually working with billboard material provided by Lamar. And that ended up being the direction everything went and now it's at a massive scale at LSU in the PMAC. In addition to all of the face shields we ended up making, which I was using a laser cutter, I was using box cutters with cardboard I was playing around with shapes, looking at how they're currently made, looking at how we can make them reusable because the biggest issue hospitals are running into was everything's disposable. But we needed to find a way to hygienic Lee clean it or make it able, in general to have that option to make it where we could reuse it.

Becky Carmichael

[4:25] Well, so with all of the work that you're doing with Wayne, it really did start with the 3D printing, is that correct? So how did you get involved with 3D printing?

Meagan Moore

[4:35] I decided, I think like during a break, Christmas, maybe just during the middle of the semester that I wanted to pick up 3D printing because I thought it was a useful tool and just dove really hard at it started playing in different modeling software from like free in the Tinkercad realm up to SolidWorks or CAD and just it was something that work naturally for me because I was already doing sculpture work with ceramics or I was playing with different materials on a lathe or a wide variety of materials that have a similar layout. And then it was just tweaking it to be more machine oriented.

Becky Carmichael

[5:18] So and then the other thing I wanted to back up with is, you mentioned you created this phantom. Now this, this phantom is not something that's small, right? This is a full, a full size replica of a person. And was this a person who had already been undergoing breast cancer treatments.

Meagan Moore

[5:39] She was actually just a Pennington Biomedical Research Center patient. And she had been part of a study where they were 3D scanning people's bodies to see averages that went across the population. And it was actually a military grade scanner that we got the files from and we're able to put into parts and print on them. meter cube printer that we have over at LSU. In the architecture department, it was a pretty broad range project that spanned a lot of different departments at LSU.

Becky Carmichael

[6:10] Wow. Okay, so for those that are listening, can you give me an idea about how big this printer and scanner really are?

Meagan Moore

[6:18] So the scanner was about, I believe seven feet tall by about six feet in diameter.

Becky Carmichael

[6:26] Oh my gosh.

Meagan Moore

[6:27] The printer itself well, meter by meter by meter, and that breaks down roughly into that three ish, three and a half foot range and it kind of like buffers from there because you only have so much of a build plate that you can actually work on.

Becky Carmichael

[6:42] Yeah. And so, the build plate is where you know as you have fed the machine, the printer the the data or the information and the build plate is what is actually discharging all kind of the plastic or whatever filter using plastic.

Becky Carmichael

[6:56] Yeah. So if you've, if you've printed out this, I don't I've seen this phantom, I've seen various forms of this phantom. It's, it's really impressive. Um, how many pieces did you have to print individually in order to form the real life replica.

Meagan Moore

[7:12] So we ended up putting her into four parts just because there are a lot of weird angles. Whenever you're working with the printer. It doesn't like anything over 45 degrees. So if you imagine just like a 90 degree angle, cut it in half, if you start getting into that range, the printer doesn't know how to attach the layer beneath it, the layer on top, and you end up getting these like slips or these little like pieces that don't fit together. And since we were trying to fill it with about 300 gallons of water, we definitely needed something that was watertight. So high precision was key. We ended up doing various coatings that were quote unquote, invisible to the different imaging machines that we had because we were looking at different particle accelerators and we were using those to recreate cancer studies within the mid range down the body from the top of the head down to the pelvic floor through a tube that I inserted into her.

Becky Carmichael

[8:07] Oh my gosh. So I didn't realize that this phantom was filled with water as well.

Meagan Moore

[8:10] It was very heavy. I had to create a cradle for her that was custom built that also had to be invisible to the equipment. And I had to figure out a way to ship or so I had to actually design and make a coffin to transport her across from Louisiana all the way to Seattle, Washington.

Becky Carmichael
[8:28] Okay, no, wait, you have not told me about this part. [laughing]

I mean, how do you even begin to articulate that in a resume or CV, Meagan?

Meagan Moore

[8:42] I mostly just put the content that I did and let like I'll broach it when it gets there. But I definitely was in contact with morticians. I was in contact with people that do woodworking. I talked with my grandfather. I had multiple points across contact in different woodworking studios maker spaces. I was just like I've never built a coffin before. I know the general idea of how to build one. I want it to be this level of rugged. So looking at the engineering of it, it was a full range engineering project I mean down from like the biomedical which is what I was focusing on to the just general structural engineering, it's something that could be, you know, shipped across the country and not to get destroyed in the process.

Becky Carmichael

[9:30] So this is this is pretty remarkable to me, because it really demonstrates you know, the fact that you've had to think outside of the box in a lot of these situations in order to achieve the main goal, which was for the cancer research, right, but you've really had to take into consideration all these other parts. So then, when you've been when Wayne called you and said, Hey, we're getting together at my garage. And you said you started from scratch? Walk me through what what for you? With Meagan's brain, how do you start to approach a problem like that?

Meagan Moore

[10:04] I start collecting materials that seem like they might be useful to whatever we're doing. In this case, it was a little bit broader. So I grabbed things from different parts of the studio and the engineering environments that are created at the house. I literally threw a 3D printer into the car I had a laser cutter in the car because I had to transport it for work to do some maintenance on it. I also had a bunch of different types of acrylic that I threw in the course and different types of knives, heating elements. I had two different types of soldering irons and multiple attachments that go with that. I mean, different types of tape, glue, a bunch of honestly a broad range of adhesive materials. And then just like the bag of random art supplies that may have been necessary down to like pipe cleaners or special types of scissors. I had fabric in there because my mom and I had been looking at making masks at the time she was making a bunch of them. And at some point with her project, we were dissecting Mardi Gras mask with the elastic to actually put on to the ear portion because stores were out at the time.

Becky Carmichael

[11:11] Oh, yeah, the stores. Yeah, that was something that, you know, I can tell you that yes, I've been playing with pipe cleaners more than I thought I would be playing with them recently, and found that I've been trying to teach myself how to sew a little bit.

Meagan Moore

[11:25] Yeah.

Becky Carmichael

[11:25] And yeah, it was, this is to me, these are those silver linings through this whole situation is your capability of being resourceful and innovative and thinking outside of the box and looking at kind of normal things, including, like you said, taking that from the Mardi Gras masks. I know I salvaged I had some of those hairs bands that had started to pull. And I'm like, Okay, well, there we go, headbands, and pipe cleaners for the nosepiece it all is. It all works. So okay, so one of the questions I had or one of the things I had on here was the fact that I've heard that Wayne Newhauser has called you Meagan the maker. And as soon as I read that, I'm like, Oh, that is so fitting. And from what you've just shared, it seems like this has always been part of a part of you and part of kind of your, your, kind of your, your personality, your, your, your existence, right. So Have you always been this creative even when you were younger? Or does this evolve at a certain point in your life?

Meagan Moore

[12:35] I definitely there's owl no, that's a dove.

That's a dove.

Becky Carmichael

[12:42] I'm appreciating the trees that you have. I have no trees at my house. Well,I have I have some crape myrtles but

Meagan Moore

[12:50] Ya know, we have a ton of different types of trees ranging from Magnolia and pine different varieties of oak and a lot of fruit trees. So pretty active.

Becky Carmichael

[13:02] But that's wonderful. I appreciate that.

Meagan Moore

[13:04] Apologies. Um, can you repeat the question one more time on that? Yeah, I got it. Um, yes, I since I was little, I was always given a broad, broad space, I was given a broad space to be creative. Both of my parents are creatives. My dad has a master's in stained glass and specialized in Korean ceramics, and then went back to school and started working in telecommunications and is actually one of the main providers and designers for LSU networks that we currently have. And then my mom got two degrees and multiple minors in fashion, merchandising and textile design. And they had a very open range of ideas and disciplines that I was exposed to my grandma was teaching me how to like, take cotton from the ground, like, throw it, comb it clean it, hand dye it. My mom and my grandma, were teaching me how to sew things. My dad taught me cooking, we ran a catering company at one point. We like we've kind of done a broad range of things and technique and overlays that happened in multiple disciplines. I mean, I did basically, every art class I could get my hands on, I made my own paper from scratch, like pulling different types of plans, learning their pH, how they can be archival. I mean, I've always just found experimenting with the science of the materials and arts very fascinating. But I've also found the beauty in the science and how important it is to acknowledge both of those and balance it I can't do one without the other. I tried. It gets really sad.

Becky Carmichael

[14:49] Well, and and so I guess, what are some of those things that you find that have been universal to you across all these areas? Is there been a couple of different aspects that you seem how you feel has been threaded through.

Meagan Moore

[15:03] I think the biggest thing that threads through for me is acknowledging that they're not going to be alone. And whenever I start on an idea, start writing down all of the ideas that you have, in the beginning, be able to have a large amount of space to just kind of tinker and explore how other people may have approached it. But also, don't be scared to come back to your initial ideas, because pretty often, there's a nugget of truth that happened there that someone else may not have had the background that you have to approach this problem from

Becky Carmichael

[15:37] Out of kind of those initial nuggets, what that stayed with some of the currents, like the face shields, did any of those initial pieces stay as you were putting those together and making those designs?

Meagan Moore

[15:50] Some of them stayed we ended up moving through prototypes very rapidly. And there was a large number of individuals that had inquired we were constantly talking with different engineers, we were talking with people that do current medical device development, we had people that were doctors and scientists in their own divisions that had their input as to how the nurses or how the physicians were going to be analyzing their patient through the garments or how they were going to be functionally using them. And they're just these micro steps along the way to also speed up the production line. And so every little factor shifted from the beginning, but it was always knowing that whatever we ended up with was going to need to be field expedient. And it was going to need to be able to be produced in some manner that could get it to the physician or whatever the caregiver in the medical community, whoever they are, whatever they needed, as fast as possible.

Becky Carmichael

[16:52] And so how many, how many gowns and face shields Were you able to? Do you have a count on that?

Meagan Moore

[16:58] I have no clue the mark LSU said for the gallons a day currently and the PMAC was around 2000 to 2500. And then the face shields keeps growing because there's different types that they've been looking at. I know at one point they were like we were able to make 500 before it hit the PMAC a day, and then it bumped from there. As soon as we had like an assembly line that was able to be developed with the different materials that we were looking at.

Becky Carmichael

[17:28] Oh my gosh, Meagan that has that really has to feel like a major contribution of yourself especially if you're still a student right you work finishing a spring semester with finals and other work right, those assignments?

It was humbling. I didn't know where the project was gonna go. And [fire truck siren]

You did tell me before we started that you were in a few hundred feet of a fire department. It's okay.

Meagan Moore

[18:00] And we'll pause for a second.

All right, yeah,

Becky Carmichael

[18:04] it's so good. Um,

Meagan Moore

[18:05] it was extremely humbling. But I know I wouldn't have done it alone. We had two other students. Well, I think we can call them both students, Katelyn Dessotell was working. She's working currently on going back into a master's program for environmental engineering. So we had a good variety and input from the renewable natural resources background that she has into what she's going into now. And being mindful of the materials and the capability of being reused in addition to a physics, physics graduate now who's going to be doing a PhD program in medical physics, Maxwell Cole, who works with Dr. Wayne Newhauser as well. And then Wayne, of course, because we were in Wayne's garage. There. There's just a slew of other volunteers that were contributing factors to making things happen. Frank Womack Over in physics is an absolute angel of a human. He was extremely resourceful and brilliant, and everybody coming together is what made this happen. I mean, everybody has their own individual parts. But if you can't work together that's going to make things come apart very quickly. And everybody was capable of working together already. We knew Max, Wayne and I, and even Kathlyn. We all work together in some capacity already on various projects. And then Frank, just Frank got has worked with all kinds of different people in physics and has this incredible, incredibly brilliant way of just addressing anything you throw at them. And so working together we were able to prototype rapidly, but also be mindful of, you know, the communication side and everybody was always open and very compassionate in didn't no wasn't really Factor are kind of like an improv. It was finding the Yes. And moving from there and making sure that everybody was happy with what was going on. And, and the hardest part honestly was trying to make sure that everybody was taking the right breaks and eating.

Becky Carmichael

[20:14] Oh, wow.

Meagan Moore

[20:14] Because when everybody, like everybody that was on the team is one of those people that can just switch off whatever they need, as far as you know, like survival, and just go straight into this working nonstop for 12 hours and then come out of it and be like, Oh, right. Bathroom, food, what are these functions?

Becky Carmichael

[20:37] That also speaks volumes to the kind of group or the kind of team that was assembled for this project. Because the other thing that, and correct me if I'm wrong, it was more than just the face shields and the gowns. Were you also trying to fabricate parts for ventilators as well.

Meagan Moore

[20:55] Mm hmm.

Becky Carmichael

[20:56] And where where has that process gone?

Meagan Moore

[20:58] So that process I don't want to say it phased out so much as it had to be passed off to people that work with medical devices. And we were able to give some insight as far as the materials, and reworking and talking with hospitals as far as like, Can we put this in an autoclave does it need to be cleaned this way? I know we can't use clear plastic because we don't have injection molding where we can get a $12,000 injection mold prototype, and since the US currently, and so like that project, ended up getting passed over to several other individuals at LSU. But we still are in contact with them off and on. And this is gonna be an ongoing thing. I mean, we've we've done kind of the first section, we had to pause as we were doing finals, Max, Katelyn and I all had finals that we were kind of working on at the same time and trying to like do final projects, but there's gonna be more to come and we're very aware of that. So we're trying to kind of do more predictive prototyping, we're kind of back in that R&Darea at this point and trying to communicate about what the next steps would be for how we can best contribute. Because in the end, we know that there are certain parts that we may not be capable of handling. But we are really good at networking and communicating and finding the people that can do those things. And that's been a strength that really came forward with this team. That is even a skill that I enjoy honing. And I'm proud and honestly privileged to have the opportunity to keep growing in that skill set, especially with like with being a student, like you said.

Becky Carmichael

[22:40] So then let's ask, let's talk a little bit about some of those. Those other collaborations. What I know you said Lamar was one of them. What are some like? Do you want to talk a little bit about how you were able to coordinate with Lamar and the donation of the, I'm assuming donation, but donation of materials and was there Other with or other groups that became involved with this?

Meagan Moore

[23:04] Yes. So the Bella Bowman Foundation was one of our key components, or one of our key starters to this project, in that they put some financial footing there. They also helped to get us in contact and network with a bunch of different people that had a variety of skills. And like you said, Yes, Lamar did help with getting us the materials. Basically, we were, I think, on day five ish. And suddenly a bunch of materials just appeared for us to play with. I had been laser cutting several different materials, and I come up with our first facial prototype, and we'd sent a bunch of those down in New Orleans. But then a bunch of billboards just appeared. We were like, what are we supposed to do with these and I was like, let's just cut out our template on that and see what happens. I mean, the worst thing that happens is it doesn't work. And so Max and I got to cut it out. Katelyn was helping with getting the templates sorted down. I was trying to also take the template and put it on the computer and do the graphic work so that we could translate it to a larger scale if possible. And all of this was just kind of happening thing after thing it was during the time that LSU it scheduled a spring break. And so we didn't have much else to do, other than do what we had an opportunity to do. And so we just kind of kept attacking it. And we were able to prototype the gown down to a certain point then my mom showed up and was on the sewing machine sealing the edges because we couldn't do the same thing we were doing with the visqueen gown. So visqueen is like a drop cloth that artists use or like whenever you paint your house you like drop it around the furniture on the wall lines that you want to protect.

Becky Carmichael

[24:50] Yeah

Meagan Moore

[24:50] We're doing some stuff with visqueen and a hot roller that pointed made out of a broken coat hanger and some washers that were attached to metal element that we were heating in like a smoker that one of the neighbors had rolled up.

Becky Carmichael

[25:06] Please tell me that you have pictures of this or videos of this.

Meagan Moore

[25:12] Thankfully yo who is Wayne's administrative assistant is also a professional photographer and she documented everything for you to be telling you like skills came out of the woodworks from everybody.

Becky Carmichael

[25:26] That is what is really inspiring when you have these types of moments. I mean, I don't I, I definitely want to acknowledge I mean, the whole the whole situation is awful. And, I mean there's all these people that are really suffering and they're the mental and the physical part of it. But again, the silver lining moments are how, how people can come together, they can share and inspire each other and they can show they can bring these skills to the table and really make it A major impact, which to me is really refreshing to see. So for everything that has been designed and it's now being manufactured in the PMAC, do you know which hospitals or what regions have received any of these materials?

Meagan Moore

[26:23] The project is honestly beyond the scope of making like meet me and the list that I was doing at the at the beginning. I know that OneLouisianaNow.com has a long list of groups. They also have an Instagram that is following four groups that they're doing their care packages for. LSU I am certain has on their COVID-19 response page, a very long list of everybody that they've been able to donate or provide gallons to based off of the various mechanisms. They have in place, but I know tons of hospitals, even hospitals up in Shreveport all the way down into Lafayette, Webster, Louisiana, just all these different places. I've seen different types of facials and gowns and things like that, from our project go to, I know that I've delivered a few things to different places. Like, I'm surprised just how well everything is still moving forward. And how many like the the numbers? And I know that's not necessarily what everybody always wants to like, follow. But then there's that group of people that very specifically want to focus on the numbers, what is the impact? How can this be scaled up things of that nature, and the capacity for scale up that the project had, we didn't even realize in the beginning, and then when it got into the PMAC, and just watching how fast you could have 15, 20, 40, 200 gallons pumped out in such a short amount of time in the reusable It was absolutely unbelievable.

Becky Carmichael

[28:04] Imagine what that had to feel like seeing that. But yeah, after all that time and work that you all put together

Meagan Moore

[28:11] Well it was really only two weeks to start off with.

Becky Carmichael

[28:13] But still that's a lot of ...

Meagan Moore

[28:16] From there,

Becky Carmichael

[28:17] wow. That's, that is incredible. Okay, so remind me, where are you? Where are you in your degree program?

Meagan Moore

[28:27] I'm classified as a senior because I have a ton of credit hours that I came into LSU with. But I've still got until 2021 before I graduate.

Becky Carmichael

[28:40] Okay, so well, I mean, so we're kind of in that final final year, right? Where are you thinking you're gonna head now?

Meagan Moore

[28:52] Genuinely, the answer is, I don't know. I've got a bunch of ideas of things that are really fascinating. To me I really have enjoyed the idea of nuclear engineering, but medical physics is also fairly promising. I know I want something that's going to have a lot of growth and innovation innately designed into the program. I've even looked at biomimicry programs across the country or even international. We've got a lot of schools that if I could even do like parts of a PhD program, and just kind of like move into and learn different skills and work with different teams throughout the process, that would be the most ideal situation for me, just because I know that being in one specific location isn't going to necessarily create the gradient and variety that I think a degree that would work best for me is going to look like

Becky Carmichael

[29:51] I could see you doing some biomimicry. I could, I can definitely see that. I would like to see what you create. Okay, so you've definitely got quite a few possibilities of where you could go. Let's, let's take a little step back, because the other way that you and I first met was when you were with BRCC, and you were doing the summer undergraduate research programs. And from there I remember one of the first things that I saw of your work, were your art. Your plating of it was a bacteria?

Meagan Moore

[30:31] Yeah, it was bacteria.

Becky Carmichael

[30:33] Yeah, so here we are. We're, we're looking at using Instagram. We're flipping through and all of a sudden I see your account, I see these plates. And I was like, Holy moly. That's Meagan. Can you tell me I never got to really ask how did you even start that?

Meagan Moore

[30:52] I was doing printmaking and screen printing at the same time that I was doing a TA work for the microbiology class that I've taken previously with Dr. Mary Miller I BRCC. And I initially was going to try and do some plate work with the screen printing device so that I could do a UV shock on the bacteria with bacteria from the Mississippi River and some of the trash that the Mississippi apparently innately just is going to have at this point right now. And so I started playing around with that. And then in the lab, I had started just kind of playing with them, trying to think of the word, oh, I started playing with the toothpicks that we had from the autoclave. And I had made kind of a color palette because we had been collecting bacteria from various parts of the goals and bacteria from the Gulf had these beautiful pinks and oranges and yellows and blues and sometimes purples. And so I just started kind of playing with placing them together and I would do some sketches on my computer and then slipping into tablet mode and put the parafilm over my computer and basically use my work as a tracing template on to the plate with the bacteria and just had to memorize where I'd put bacteria already and you could kind of see a little indentation on the top. And then I would just let it grow and see if it would grow or if it wouldn't, and I started playing with classical art pieces, my own art pieces, it ended up in an art gallery actually at the beginning or end of last year into the beginning of this year. And I actually had some other pieces that were in there that included the purple lady that 3d printed, I had made some mandalas using data from the research and rendered them into repeating patterns. And then I had some other pieces where I played with the concept of apoptosis which is a program that almost every organism every organism does have but some have a prolonged phase so not to touch on that. The apoptosis piece paired with the bacteria pieces and then I started making scientific bow ties.

Becky Carmichael

[33:08] Bow ties. Those were made out of, that was, like the pieces that you were doing the laser cutting, right?

Meagan Moore

[33:13] Yeah, no, that was all laser cut.

Becky Carmichael

[33:16] Oh my gosh. So this, this wealth of artistic approach to science. Have you found yourself teaching this in any capacity to others and how has the art side of this helps you in conveying, like, complex processes?

Meagan Moore

[33:38] So I'm actually the Special Projects manager over at St. Joseph's Academy currently and like I work one on one with students and whatever they come up with, they'll kind of help them feel out what materials are available. I specifically meet with the science students but I also meet just as much with the art students and talk with them about materials, archival properties. If you were to expose it to UV for a certain amount of time, how is it going to change all of the components that you're working with currently? What can you use to modify that or benefit your piece? or How can you work with composition with a range of materials? And then, I mean, I also work with my fellow students sometimes on what they're working on. I'll like, pop into part of a senior design project and talk with them about the materials that they're looking at, or how they can move through a certain process. And I mean, that range goes from everything and like multiple ranges of engineering, like I've talked with me, students, I've talked with civil students, I've talked with our Biological and Biomedical students, environmental students, and I,

I genuinely enjoy talking with people from different disciplines and I'll go sit in on talks at LSU just for the hell of it. Because I mean, when else and where else are you going to have an opportunity to listen to someone do it Some radiological study talk of the same day that you're listening to someone do an entire Civil War breakdown and the Creole history and like how that affects Native American and Black students culturally in this day and age, and it's a privilege to have access to such a wide variety of knowledge in such a small space, seemingly small space.

Becky Carmichael

[35:23] Well, no, I think that that's absolutely an important point to make. I think that sometimes we forget that we have that access, and those opportunities, as well as even the wealth that is housed in, in the libraries on campus, the librarians, being able to go and interact with just even faculty members, students, etc. You know, you're all there for a reason. You're all wanting to improve and increase your own knowledge and you want to explore So yeah, I think that there needs to be more, more interaction. We need to take advantage of that a little bit more. I'm excited. To see how those evolve based on, you know, coming, going and moving through this. But yeah, I think that people are finding innovative ways to still connect and explore these unknowns or even just kind of allow themselves that time to think. That's awesome.

Meagan Moore

[36:20] I can't wait to see what I get into this summer. I've started my laundry list, as it were, of opportunities is what I like to call him. So I've started, like, I started going down the list, and each day I try and do at least one sometimes it becomes a multi day thing. If it's like, I need to get in contact with someone or I need to order something or see if someone else has different elements or if they're interested in collaborating, I can send them something and like, you know, sterilize it. And obviously, doing social distancing, if you're going to be doing collaborations but there's still a lot of opportunities to be innovative and creative, like you said during this time, and it's going To take thinking of ways that have not been thought pathway, like pathways that haven't been thought through entirely and kind of feeling out what that means what that looks like. And that's the only way we're all gonna get through this and see the results that we would ideally like to see or fabricate them for that matter.

Becky Carmichael

[37:19] So that really kind of leads me into that question of what's next for you, Meagan? And so you've said you've been listing some of those opportunities, is there any of those that you'd want to share?

Meagan Moore

[37:29] I really want to get into doing more biomaterials play, and with that, I mean like growing different types of mycelium, so the messy underneath of mushrooms whenever they're creating their foundation, I can 3D print a mold that those mushrooms the mycelium will grow into and so like if I work with oyster mushrooms or chicken in the woods and like playing with the different structural material and integrity that they have, I can play with what that means. If we dry it out if we keep it alive, I also like laser cutting on it to keep in mind, you know, the capacity is the aesthetic of a piece. If you're working from that angle, there's certain elements of welding that I'd like to play with. And then a lot of what I do is honestly just coming down to play, and how I can use these things in different areas that I'm already doing. So I really do enjoy doing like acro yoga, and I want to get more into doing lira, which is like a giant hoop suspended into the air that you do work on. And so I'm learning different skills in order to play in those areas a little bit more, but also, in order to explore what my capabilities and like limits are, because you won't know what your limits are until you start kind of pushing into them.

Becky Carmichael

[38:50] I think that I think it's fun to kind of do those things and also, I don't know about you, but for me whenever I am doing some kind of what I call, yeah, it's play. So if I'm doing something, if I'm doing something that's involved with beading, or I'm baking, there's something about demon during that time, while you're sitting there and you're focused on that task, I find that also my mind will, will just become more free and I can start thinking about other things that have been on my radar been on my to do list. And sometimes that's how I get those ideas that really just kind of come up. So yeah.

Meagan Moore

[39:32] Absolutely I know, the best ideas and the best honestly studying but I have comes out of giving myself space to play. And I mean, I know some people can like hammer out of like, full credit semester. And I actually work better with having like two or three projects and then a part time semester, enemy like it's learning what works best for you. I know that we all have different elements that we need to explore further. Sometimes it's not Available financially or otherwise, and it comes back to play. If you can play you're going to have a much better time doing at least 90% of whatever you're getting into.

Becky Carmichael

Now. So sounds like that's been a very beneficial thing for you to do for the collaboration on the network. And you've been able to engage in it.

Meagan Moore

[40:50] For sure.

Becky Carmichael

[40:52] And. Okay, so I can't let you go. I always ask my guests. Two questions, and I am really excited to ask you this. So the first question is in research, in STEM, we all have these moments that come about that just are like what the heck happened, right? So can you share with us your craziest, weirdest our most dangerous thing that you've done in the name of your work?

Meagan Moore

[41:33] Um, let's see, it probably goes back to the purple lady. Currently, just because she was such a long process and it would be...I mean this falls under dangerous, but also mildly entertaining. So we were at the, Let's say, what's its technical name… It was like a Fast Neutron Facility in Seattle. And so, this area is what is called radioactively hot and so you'll start having your doseminator or your dose meter.

Meagan Moore

[42:07] That you were in order to read out what radiation, you're being exposed to and so we're like in this hospital we're setting things up. It looks like a Star Trek set and we're like filling this purple lady that I printed and have been toting around in a hospital just like, bear hug carrying her through the hospital, looking around, people are looking at me like I'm crazy. I finally get her into her cradle on the table and we start filling it with water and we finish the process. Get all the readings done and we have to let her sit. The next day we come back and she's still a little radioactively hot and we start moving the water out from inside of her and the levels are dropping and it was the moment.

Meagan Moore

[43:05] Whenever we finally got the water level low enough and we couldn't figure out how to get the rest of the water out of her because there's a lot of weird chambers between the legs and the levels with the head and arms. Because she was basically posing like she was going to take you out for the scan because they instruct them to stand with their hands. With the fist kind of flared slightly from the side of the body feet. Spread a little bit apart and I'm like a better flipped upside down and like shaking this purple human violently to get the water out into the trash can, that we're collecting the water out of the body.

Becky Carmichael

[43:29] Because the water is hot right?

Meagan Moore

[43:31] Yeah, well, and she's radioactively hot so, like, I get things on me, but I'm also trying to get it done as fast as possible.

Meagan Moore

[43:39] And I look over and one of my colleagues is taking video and pictures of me.

Meagan Moore

[43:43] Doing this entire long line of nonsense. And so that kind of falls under absurdity, danger sure course radiation, but also just like one of those humbling moments where you're like, All right, like in the name of research. This is my existence and I'll take it.

Becky Carmichael

[44:03] And, um, I do want to share a picture. If you have one of you and the purple lady, because I think that's the only way to really get a good sense for exactly the size of a, really of her.

Becky Carmichael

[44:17] Yeah, I would have taken a video of you doing that. That's totally appropriate. Okay. So the second question to ask is, and this I think is, again, this one is right up your alley. Do you know who MacGyver is?

Meagan Moore

[44:35] Yes. So paperclip in a rubber band, what Yeah. What can you make...

Becky Carmichael

[44:42] Something crazy right. And so again you know you're doing your research, you're in a pinch. Can you share with us an instance when you've had to MacGyver your way through?

Meagan Moore

[44:55] Oh my god.

Becky Carmichael

[44:56] Get the job done.

Meagan Moore

[44:57] Yeah, I feel like, oh, this guy. Okay, no.

Meagan Moore

[45:00] This is a really good one. Alright, so, um, we have just gotten to Seattle and of course is coming back to the purple lady. I have experience. Actually, I'm going to, I'm going to tell you to because I think they're equally as absurd. So I'm going to tell you the purple lady one verse. So we are in the CT scanner and we do our first scan and we noticed the water level is kind of going wild and we go in and we started inspecting your body and really where's this leak? And we find it in the crotch.

Meagan Moore

[45:35] And we don't have any material. At the time, there is a Lowe’s up the street, we are trying to get this thing scanned and ready so we can get her into one of the best, one of the one of the proton areas. And so one of our team members is like, I don't know what we can use. Everybody starts emptying their backpacks onto the floor in the clinic and someone has a pack of watermelon Trident gum.

Meagan Moore

[46:00] And so everybody ends up chewing watermelon Trident gum. I had everyone spit, the gum into my hand, make it into a pit, like a little ball, and then cram it onto the crotch of this model and it holds. So in our publication, there will be a credited line to Trident watermelon gum specifically about how that saved the day for getting us to the next phase of the clinical work.

Becky Carmichael

[46:28] So did you know all the people in there that were involved?

Meagan Moore

[46:32] Yeah, I just met them that day. We had talked on the phone. Maybe two or three times and I was just like, look, this is where we're at. So be it.

Becky Carmichael

[46:45] Oh my gosh that's hysterical.

Meagan Moore

[46:49] Yeah. Yeah. And the second story. So we had done a launch with we've done a launch in Palestine, Texas at NASA. And we're going to do recovery. And one of the rules and requirements for doing a launch for the recovery phase is you have to have permission to retrieve your payload from someone's property if it's on a private piece of land.

Meagan Moore

[47:13] So we get in contact with them and we can't figure out exactly where things landed but we are looking at Google Maps and we can see that there is swamp everywhere. And we're like, oh boy. I hope our payloads didn't fall in the water. So we get in contact with the guy. And we're like, Hey, do you have something we can use. We see a boat on the property. And he's like, yeah, you can use the boat, but all the paddles washed out in the last flood that we had. So we're going up a creek as a group. Without paddles, paddling instead with two by fours and four by 12, up the creek.

Meagan Moore

[47:53] And we finally get to the location where we're getting the radar from the GPS that's attached to the payload string and it's open a tree. So we end up having to get a chainsaw after paddling down the creek, come back up the creek and the tree gets chopped down and that is how all of the payloads got recovered. But it was an entirely ridiculous scenario where we kept having to go under fallen trees and branches to get this area cleaned up and there's like boatloads of branch loads of spiders just falling into the boat on everybody. This is how you find out that some people have arachnophobia and they start clinging to you.

Meagan Moore

[48:25] Okay. Everybody is still paddling. And they're snakes and there's tiny alligators and like it's just an absurd scene. That when the day was over. We were all still not completely convinced that it actually happened because of how ridiculous the entire process.

Becky Carmichael

[48:46] Okay, I have 1000 questions. So what were you launching?

Meagan Moore

[48:52] Oh, we were launching these payloads. So payloads are whatever you have designed to collect data. And so we had a rectangular keyboard or basically a box. And the box was suspended on cables and then on the top of that was a high altitude balloon, a massive helium balloon. That is coated with what feels like a powdered sandwich bag. Basically, and it goes up 100,000 feet into the atmosphere.

Meagan Moore

[49:19] And then you choose when to release your payloads to start collecting it and it's collecting data on its way up and on its way back down. And so this is actually part of a program between BRCC and LSU, and I believe it's still ongoing. But it's kind of changed a little bit since then. And every year of the collection phase is very different. This was my second year launching with the team and it was absolutely ridiculous. So once you collect your payloads and you go and you do your data analysis and the next day, you have a very fast turnaround, you present all of your data.

Becky Carmichael

[49:52] Oh wow.

Meagan Moore

[49:53] Or in some people's cases their failure analysis, which is just as much of a learning experience.

Becky Carmichael

[49:58] Mm hmm. I agree. Agreed. You just, you know, don't think that there's nothing to be gained by failure. I feel like that's sometimes the best thing that can happen is, what did I, what messed up. So okay, so you've done this for two years. Are you still working with this group?

Meagan Moore

[50:17] I am not currently working with this group, I'd love to continue working with them, they're a phenomenal team on absolutely every level. They are brilliant, skilled, very different types of people to work with. And they're in the same, like, they're in the physics building. So I literally just went up a floor on the physics building and me and my other lab that I'm in.

Becky Carmichael

[50:41] My gosh, Meagan, this is, this has been fascinating. I can tell you that I like, I don't mind spiders, but in that situation. Every time I've been around snakes. Snakes come toward me and I even, you know, either. I've been sitting somewhere doing something and they've crawled across my feet. Or they crawled right to me. And I'm like, Come on, there's a whole pine savannah. You couldn't have gone left or right. So I always think that in those situations. That's what sends me over.

Meagan Moore

[51:17] Yeah, but, um...

Becky Carmichael

[51:20] You got your payload. You got to take...

Meagan Moore

[51:23] Well, I mean, some of them got dumped in water. Originally, but ours was recovered.

Becky Carmichael

[51:29] Well then that's good. At least, at least you got that data. Oh my goodness. Is there anything else that you would want to share, you would want someone to know about your work that you've been doing recently?

Meagan Moore

[51:43] I mean, I'm more interested in it. If people want to be part of collaborations and contacts. I mean, We have a lot of opportunities within our lab to do research and I'm actually in the process of trying to develop what my next project is going to be. So I'm looking at different

Platforms and layouts for collaboration across the spectrum. I mean, very broad range. And so I'm kind of excited to network and talk with different teams, be it the professors that allows you to other institutions and we've got a lot of capability to do a bunch of really interesting aspects of research.

Becky Carmichael

[52:23] My goodness. Well, Meagan. I do want to thank you so much for doing this with me today. I'm, I'm so glad I got to speak to you and then learn. About some of these other projects. Um, so yeah. And I think that I definitely want to make sure that we have some of those pictures so we can share. Yeah, so...

Meagan Moore

[52:42] I get a screenshot of it, yeah. Oh, yeah. Do you want one of you in the closet?

Becky Carmichael

[52:48] Yeah, you can do that. And I'm going to tell you, hey, Meagan, thank you so much for doing this with me, it's been a real pleasure.

Meagan Moore

[52:54] Absolutely. Thank you, Becky

Becky Carmichael

[52:56] You're welcome.

This episode of LSU Experimental was recorded and produced at home, and it's supported by LSU's Communication across the Curriculum and the College of Science. Today’s interview was conducted by me, Becky Carmichael. Our theme music is Bramby at Full Gallop by PCIII. To learn more about today's episode, ask questions and recommend future investigators. Visit cxc.lsu.edu/experimental. And while you're there, subscribe to the podcast. We're available on SoundCloud, iTunes, Stitcher and Google Play.